The Smoking Thing: Why Americans Dread Visiting Serbia

The Smoking Thing: Why Americans Dread Visiting Serbia | B92 Blog http://blog.b92.net/blog/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Rosemary Bailey Brown sr http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss rss@b92.net rss@b92.net Blog A-JE! RSS generator v0.3 Fri, 10 Feb 2012 19:07:18 +0000 http://blog.b92.net/user_stuff/avatars/mali/247/10247.jpg Rosemary Bailey Brown http://blog.b92.net/ 50 50 Re: chill http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k258357

momocow

Part of the charm of belgrade IS the smoking! I love the smell, I love the decadence, after a few weeks maybe I'll pick up the habbit. Then stop when I go back home. When in rome, do as the romans. Mostly liberal pussies and hypochondriacs fear second hand smoke, humm, and the few asthmatics here and there...

Chill out and live a little, enjoy.
Oh, yes of course! That wonderful sensation of choking and loosing the air when you are in a bart where there is no ventilation or if there is one, it does not work, and your'e surrounded with the smelly smoke from all sides that enters your hair, your clothes, your lungs and your blood... And you have two choices: to stay there and accept the poisoning yopu are submitted for your friends sake and try to look as if everything is cool, or to refuse to sit in such an unpleasant place and to take a risk to be qualified as a "libaral pussy and hypochondriac".

Yeah, chill out, you stupid non-smokers... In your grave.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 20 May 2008 09:53:40 GMT Brunehilda http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: Smrt bivsim pusacima http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k258351

Srki

Milan M. Ćirković

Mungos

But as far as I know leaded gasoline has been prohibited long ago (in 70s or so) and for much more serious reason than the cancer rate - the danger of lead poisoning and induced disorders including several heavy mental illnesses being much higher per unit time than the danger of cancer... That is one of the rare examples where concern for public health did outweigh any private and corporate savings achieved with the leaded gas.

That explains some things in Serbia ;-).

Oooo, yes, indeeed! :) ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 20 May 2008 09:45:11 GMT Brunehilda http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: Smrt bivsim pusacima http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k258346
Ja, kao bivši 20-godišnji pušač, kažem BLJAK i još uvek ne mogu da shvatim samu sebe kako sam mogla uopšte da uvlačim taj odvratni smrdljivi dim u svoja pluća. Najviše se ljutim pre svega na SAMU SEBE, a pušače žalim jer nisu svesni da ubijaju lagano i neprimetno, ajd što same sebe, to je njihov izbor, nego i svoju okolinu gde uglavnom najviše deca istih stradaju, ni kriva ni dužna.

Kamo lepe sreće da ovah tipično srpski mentalitet i komentar : "Bivši pušači su najgori" što pre nestane i da pušači shvate da koliko god oni imaju pravo da odaberu da sebe truju, drugi imaju još veće pravo da odaberu da ne budu trovani, gušeni u smradu cigarete samo zato što pušać želi da vrši svoje lagano samoubistvo za koje misli da je gle, zadovoljstvo! Međutim, mislim da, što se toga tiče, Srbija najmanje 40 godina kaska za ostalim evropskim zemljama, a za USA, neću ni da pominjem, dele ih svetlosne godine...

Meni lično, i to oduvek a ne samo od kad sam prestala da pušim, to je bio najveći problem pri mojim posetama rodne grude. Neverovatno je koliko su ljudi u Srbiji NESVESNI svoje fatalne greške i sa koliko puno drčnosti traže i brane svoje pravo na ubijanje sebe i drugih, i kako svoje pravo na cigaretu uzimaju kao neko prirodno pravo, i ne pada im na pamet da li možda ipak nekom mogu da smetaju. Jedna mala anegdota.

Pre neku godinu, kad sam bila u poseti svojoj porodici i prijateljima u Srbiji, dogovorih se sa jednom prijateljicom da odemo na ručak. Dok smo tako nas dve ručkale i čavrljale, javila se još jedna prijateljica i rekla da će doći do restorana. Nakon izvesnog vremena, da druga ulazi u restoran, prilazi našem stolu za kojim nas dve još uvek jedemo, seda i mrtva ladna vadi cigarete i pali duvajući dim u naše zabezeknute face (zabezeknutija sam bila ja, nego ova druga, što je valjda normalno) a ja ne mogu prosto da poverujem onome što vidim... To se na zapadu vidi kao prvoklasna nekultura i samoživost, dok se u Srbiji vidi kao nešto sasvim normalno i ne dao ti bog da prigovoriš, jer ćeš odmah biti žigosan kao "taj dosadni bivši pušač, šta se tu sad folira a pušio je tolike godine... " Neverovatno! ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 20 May 2008 09:28:32 GMT Brunehilda http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k87161
Emir Halilovic:
It's not about isolating smokers from non-smokers, it's about isolating non-smokers from cigarette smoke. It's pretty clear. Once you decide to chew tobacco, nicotine gum, wear nicotine patches etc.--no problem for me.

Your proposed solution to the problem equals me proposing that non-smokers wear gas-masks. No, I'm affraid it is not non-smokers vs. smoke problem. It is non-smokers vs. smokers problem. It's a people problem. And it becomes especially visible when you, among others, start to glow over the demeaning and humiliating treatment that smokers are now getting. The satisfaction in your cyber voice, the superiority with which you throw insults at smokers (and not the smoke) - well, Emir, I just hope you never experience the same treatment for whatever reason by anyone in life. But, chances are: as you sow, so you shall reap. Probably at some other field, but nevertheless... I admire your courage to glow over anyone's misery. Even while smokers had absolute rights, they never glowed over the suffering of non-smokers.

Emir Halilovic:
At your age, your attitude is understandable. I hope that you can explain your "enjoy life" attitude to people who are dying from lung cancer or have had their legs amputated due to smoking-related vascular problems.

Very puzzling paragraph. First of, how would you know my age? Enlighten me, please. And tell me you are 80 and, oh, so wise.

As for MY "enjoy life" attitude - whatever would I need to explain it to others? It is my life, my enjoyment, my risk. Not theirs.

Emir Halilovic:
It's not name calling, these are facts--to a non-smoker, smokers stink. Also, nicotine addiction is like any other addiction, therefore most smokers are addicts. Simple.

Actually, it is not even the words you use, Emir. Personally, I don't mind being a stinky addict. I don't mind even smoking in cubicals - can be fun: thinking of starting a new hobby of collecting various animal ears I can draw from the purse and put on my head while in the cage. Must also record various animal roars to play on loud-speakers while in, to entertain the bored kids waiting for their delayed flight, if nothing else.

What it is, Emir, is your superior glowing over other people's misery. Non-smoking might be healthy. But that glowing... that deffinitely isn't.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:40:57 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k87125

Krugolina Borup

Srki:
You seem to be dumb after all.

Emir Halilovic:
...it makes one really feel satisfied that there are parts of the world where stinky addicts are really being put where they belong...

Sure, that's the way to go: when you run out of arguments, resort to name calling.

Wishing you a pleasant, healthy life, boys. May God protect you from the other dangers of this world until you die of old age, while you spend your life worrying about them. Meantime, I'll enjoy life. While it lasts. For whatever period of time it lasts.

Krugolina - The Dumb Stinky Addict

It's not name calling, these are facts--to a non-smoker, smokers stink. Also, nicotine addiction is like any other addiction, therefore most smokers are addicts. Simple.

Other than that, I think your assumption that non-smokers do not smoke solely because it's unhealthy is simplistic. I don't smoke because I don't enjoy it, because it stinks, because I think being an addict is demeaning, and because smoking is unhealthy. In that order. Other people may give other reasons.

At your age, your attitude is understandable. I hope that you can explain your "enjoy life" attitude to people who are dying from lung cancer or have had their legs amputated due to smoking-related vascular problems.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Wed, 07 Nov 2007 11:44:15 GMT Emir Halilovic http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k87100

irvas

oh yeah? how abot gays, ha? maybe we should put them where they belong as well?

final soulution?

now that's satisfaction isn't it emir?!

For homework: apples and oranges-->Google it.

Let me make it clear--in my opinion, smokers belong with each other when they smoke. It's not about isolating smokers from non-smokers, it's about isolating non-smokers from cigarette smoke. It's pretty clear. Once you decide to chew tobacco, nicotine gum, wear nicotine patches etc.--no problem for me.

As for Munich, Germans are very practical and polite people, so instead of completely banning smoking in the terminal (which can be offending to addicts, ergo--not polite) or letting addicts smoke in specifically designated open spaces (which is, again, inefficient and impractical) they've decided to isolate them in specifically designated cubicles. Neat, isn't it?

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Wed, 07 Nov 2007 11:05:28 GMT Emir Halilovic http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k87006 Srki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lung_cancer

Not good enough. A secondary source.
I go for the original studies, you see. Not for what others report about them. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Wed, 07 Nov 2007 06:41:23 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86995
oh yeah? how abot gays, ha? maybe we should put them where they belong as well?

final soulution?

now that's satisfaction isn't it emir?! ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Wed, 07 Nov 2007 03:28:16 GMT irvas http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86740
Srki:
You seem to be dumb after all.

Emir Halilovic:
...it makes one really feel satisfied that there are parts of the world where stinky addicts are really being put where they belong...

irvas

STOP DISCRIMINATION AGAINST SMOKERS!!!

vidimo se ljudi

Newsflash: that boat has already sailed. I wish I took a picture of "the smoking cabin" in Munich airport--it makes one really feel satisfied that there are parts of the world where stinky addicts are really being put where they belong...
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 16:05:49 GMT Emir Halilovic http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86645

Krugolina Borup

Now, please, where did Krugolina say that? And then YOU ask ME whether I'm dumb or playing dumb?

To summarize what Krugolina argues:

- Krugolina does not believe in passive smoking health risks, because even the authority that argues that that risk exists, did allow at least one study with the opposite result to be published in the major medical journal.

- Krugolina's common sense tells her that smoking can't possibly be healthy, but Krugolina also has doubts of how unhealthy it really is, being inclined to think that the whole thing is presented as much worse then it is.

- Regardless of how unhealthy it is, however, Krugolina thinks everybody should be left to decide whether they want to take that risk or not. It is my body, my life, my death. Government should back off and go regulate a traffic or something... not me.

Sorry Krugolina, I guess I was wrong about you earlier. You seem to be dumb after all. So never mind all I said

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lung_cancer

Srdjan

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 15:24:09 GMT Srki http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: ... http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86517
Quick search of just a couple of studies available on the net seem to indicate that up to 15 ciggies a day is the limit of "responsible smoking".

Now, why isn't that published on my ciggie pack? ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 09:51:56 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: ... http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86511 Ničeov šegrt:
Rubbish. The easiest example is the fact that the legal age limit for boozing up is 21, and it's 18 for smoking. The more elaborate example would be what colleges do, by sending their students birthday cards asking them not to engage in binge drinking. Nothing about binge smoking there. Thirdly, every ad for alcohol I've seen had "drink responsibly" somewhere in it, therefore your argument is not consistent with reality. Fourthly, there is no such thing as moderate smoking whereas there is such thing as moderate drinking. Moderate drinking will not leave long term effects on one's body while long term smoking will, even if they only manifest as black lungs and nothing else. While I am an avid fan of the X-Files, saying that smokers are singled out for an unknown reason or, alternatively, because of some government experiment involving hypnosis goes well beyond what I'm able to imagine. It sounds mildly paranoid.

You talking about States, right? Because, there's no age limit for boozing up over here. And no university sends you birthday cards. And adds for beer over here are promoting religious alcoholism ("I majstori imaju dušu!"

, without any "drink responsibly" cautions attached to it. But ciggie packs lie to you that "smoking kills", and you have the age limit for buying ciggies. Therefore, your argument is not consistent with reality here, though it might be describing the situation in the States.

Frankly, I wouldn't mind equivalent of what is done for drinking, applied to smoking. Put the age limit. Send me a birthday card warning me about possible health risks. Stick the "smoke responsibly" reminder on the ciggie packs (but don't lie that it kills!). All of it can go under "educational" effort of the authority. However, when it comes to regulations... I don't see anybody regulating drinking in public places the way smoking is regulated. And that is what I'm talking about.

As for what drinking and smoking do to our own bodies - you are again missing the point. We are not talking about that. I thought we agreed that we should be left to do to our bodies whatever we are inclined to (or are you against abortion, maybe?). I thought we are discussing whether, and to which point, should the authority be involved in regulating things that are bad for OTHER PEOPLE, those that might be hurt by our smoking or drinking or whatever. Passive smoking is, according to at least one study, harmless. Passive drinking is often fatal, and you need no study for that. All you need is your own eyes. I can smoke and drive and won't kill anyone. Not the case with drinking and driving. I will smoke and not get violent. Not the case with drinking. And those two don't need "overdrinking". A moderate one will quite often do.

As for health service costs, passive smoking and passive drinking victims that ask for medical help - well, do I need say more, or did we all see how "walking in the door" looks like first hand at least once in our lives?

RE: moderate smoking and moderate drinking. There DEFFINITELY is a difference between smoking less and smoking more. Look at any smoking study. When they interview smokers, they take care to note down how many ciggies a day they smoke. If it did not make any difference, they surely wouldn't bother doing that. What they don't do is - they are not researching the limit of ciggies that body can cope with per day or per week (while they do so for alcohol) and they are not campaigning about "responsible smoking" (as they do with alcohol).

Quite a few people have told me that their doctors told them how up to 5 to 10 ciggies a day is totally ok, something body can cope with and clean out. Now, how reliable that is, I have no idea. I don't trust doctors much, especially not the ones in Serbia. So, we need a study or research. Who is going to finance it? Surely not the pharmaceutical and medical mafia. And if tobacco industry does it, they will be accused of being biased. So, we are kept in the dark, again...

Now, as for the X files... I actually hate the show. As well as all SF and "dreamed up" movies. Give me a movie that has "based on the true life story" in it, and I'll watch it. But not the ones clouded in mistery and completely dreamed up. As passive smoking health risks are.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 09:16:28 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: ... http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86478

No one is doing shit about the drinking problem. A short and mild campaign here and there, but nothing comparable to the restrictions smokers are subjected to. No one dreams of banning drinking in pubs.

Rubbish. The easiest example is the fact that the legal age limit for boozing up is 21, and it's 18 for smoking. The more elaborate example would be what colleges do, by sending their students birthday cards asking them not to engage in binge drinking. Nothing about binge smoking there. Thirdly, every ad for alcohol I've seen had "drink responsibly" somewhere in it, therefore your argument is not consistent with reality. Fourthly, there is no such thing as moderate smoking whereas there is such thing as moderate drinking. Moderate drinking will not leave long term effects on one's body while long term smoking will, even if they only manifest as black lungs and nothing else. While I am an avid fan of the X-Files, saying that smokers are singled out for an unknown reason or, alternatively, because of some government experiment involving hypnosis goes well beyond what I'm able to imagine. It sounds mildly paranoid. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 02:16:48 GMT Nietzsches Aprentice http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smokers of the world - unite! http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86467 You want to fart, do it in your own PRIVATE fart room. Not in a public place.
Farting is healthy, especially at my ripe age of 62! Only some inconvenient second hand side effects

I am surprised with Slovenia ranking but we should improve considerably as smoking was recently baned at all public places. Unleaded fuel only here. I choked for few days in Belgrade but then my Balkan imunity returned

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 00:59:59 GMT s56a http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86462 DejanOz:
its not about how bad smoking is. of course is bad. no one could possibly deny this

Srki:
I guess, Krugolina was trying to do that few comments above. Isn't that silly?! ;-)

Srki:
I could agree with you about the CocaCola, and fast food and some other crap, but that is not as supported with studies of imminent risks, as smoking is.

And why isn't it supported by the studies? Because all the money is spent on studies about the smoking!

Srki:
CocaCola is there for over 40 years and still no one come up with a study showing that it is bad for your health.

Did anybody ever try? Did anyboy ever do a study? How many studies? How big a sample?

Srki:
Yeah, you'll get fat if you drink it a lot, and you'll become caffeine addict, or you can damage your cells with too much aspartame, but you need to take a lot of it. But you won't die of cancer directly caused by it.

Right. You won't die of cancer. You'll die of heart-attack.
Last time I read the statistics, heart diseases were number 1 killers, even worse then cancer.

Srki:
But if smokers are given ANY rights, like in Serbia for example, rest of us wouldn't have any choice...

If we change your "any" into "absolute", then your sentence reads as completely true. As we have seen so far. Therefore, I'm all for protecting non-smokers, and giving them the fresh air they need. But, I am against giving them ABSOLUTE rights, which is what you seem to argue here as the only possible solution.

Srki:
I have a question for smokers. I understand they are addicts, same as junkies and their craving for nicotine is of organic nature. But why don't smokers as addicts decide to use nicotine pills, or injections, or patches for example, instead of careless poisoning everybody around?

I'm a smoker, so let me answer that.

a) I would rather finance tobacco industry then pharmaceutical mafia, therefore ciggies, and not their products.

b) Will you stop that idiotic propaganda of inducing non-founded poisoning of others theory, pretty please? If second smoking really kills, by now "Srba bi ostalo taman toliko da svi stanu pod jednu šljivu".

Srki:
I never smoked, so I speculate on this : is It because they think it is sort of cool to suck the candle and produce the damn smoke? Does that give them some importance in their own eyes? Are they insecure about themselves? I am not sure and I don't claim anything, I'd like to know and understand...

Now, Srki da...beep, don't do that, please! I am the wanna-be-psychologer around here!

If you would like to truly know and understand anything in life, you have to do it yourself. But, I guess it is too much to ask from a life-time non-smoker, so maybe you should just give up on trying to understand, save yourself from cancer, and die of something else. May it be old age, I pray.

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 00:52:06 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86443 DejanOz:
Oh, you've made yourself perfectly clear! Because the governments haven't done everything they possibly can to combat every potential health hazard that exists, that means that they should leave the smokers alone.

No, it doesn't mean that. But it surely means that they should have prioritized and started with the problems that are worse than smoking. Like, drinking.

Plus, on the top of that, what government is doing isn't "combating the health hazard of smoking". What government is doing is: parenting us. If they were really convinced of the health hazards of smoking, they would have banned the production of ciggaretes.

DejanOz:
And, why stop there? Maybe they should even encourage smoking, give substinance from the budget for cigarettes to be issued for free at schools and hospitals, and so on.

No. There's no such thing as a free lunch.

What they should do is invest some money in the research of how to make ciggaretes helthier. Have some new laws of what tobacco industry can and can not put in the ciggaretes, when additives are concerned. Inform the public of the findings. Maybe invest in the research of how many ciggies a day is ok, and does not bring any risk. Promote the minimum level, and encourage people to maybe go down to those level. And then, they should BACK OFF, leaving people to chose their risks themselves. They should also regulate enough fresh air for non-smokers, but NOT BY CANCELING THE RIGHTS OF SMOKERS.

Government should educate, not regulate. Government is not supposed to be my parent.

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Tue, 06 Nov 2007 00:12:26 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86436 DejanOz:
Alcoholic drinks are already heavily regulated (and taxed) in many western societies (much more so than in Serbia).

Oh, give me a break, please!!! When they ban drinking in pubs, then you can stand up and say that they are "heavily regulating" drinking!

FYI, in Serbia, if you are under 18, you can't buy ciggies. But, if you are under 18, it goes without saying that you can buy alcohol.

And, then, tell me that it does not prove the thesis that smokers are singled out for some reason. EVEN IN SERBIA!
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:59:57 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: ... http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86428 Nietzsches Aprentice:
I'm sorry, can you explain why a government would gang up on one specific industry, a very lucrative one as well, if it didn't profit from it somehow? What does "the authority" gain by marginalizing smoking? So that people would stop smoking and start buying billions of workout gadgets? I don't buy that. Yes, most people are idiots, but that doesn't mean that every government intervention is to the end of exploiting their idiocy.

I don't know. YOU TELL ME. But, there has to be a reason. You can't deny the following:

a) There are worse risks for health then smoking that are even wider spread then smoking - like drinking. Drinking induced illnesses have higher medical costs then smoking induced ones.

b) No one is doing shit about the drinking problem. A short and mild campaign here and there, but nothing comparable to the restrictions smokers are subjected to. No one dreams of banning drinking in pubs.

c) Therefore, we must conclude smokers are singled out for some specific reason.

Why? My guess is as good as yours. For all we know, they might just be practicing how well their manipulation and power of hypnosis works.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:53:25 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: Smoking http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86420 Jaril:
I do not smoke neither - cigarettes or marijuana. And I visit cafes/clubs very rarely.

But I am patient about smokers.

God bless you.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:38:55 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smokers of the world - unite! http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86418 Krugolina (previously):
Smoking may (or may not) increase the risk of getting some forms of cancer.

DejanOz:
It does so, beyond any reasonable doubt, so what is your point here? It's all just nonsense.

No, it doesn't, at least not beyond any reasonable doubt.

But, for discussion purposes, let's say that it does. Let's say that smoking does increase the risk of getting some cancer. If that is the case, and if that is what research shows, why my pack of ciggies reads: "SMOKING KILLS!" instead of "Smoking does increase the risk of getting some forms of cancer"?

That is not just manipulation of the facts on the part of "authoritative body", be it government, pharmaceutical or medical mafia, or whoever is in charge of coming up with those campaigns. It is pure and simple lying. And if they lie about that, why should I trust them about other stuff, like counting in their research? ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:31:59 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ chill http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86022
Chill out and live a little, enjoy. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 11:28:57 GMT momocow http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smokers of the world - unite! http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k86009 Srki:
Sorry, Krugolina, It is very hard I would be your "darling", I don't like ashtray taste in my mouth, and cigarette stink on my cloth.

Wow! Aint't we sure of our macho irressistibility! Time-out, Srki da...beep. Big misunderstanding here!

You see, Srki da...beep, when I face the amount of agression like yours, I have one of two choices: a) sink to your level, and reply in the same fashion; or b) clasify it as childish tantrum, and switch into the motherly mode. So, it's a motherly "da...beep", Srki, da...beep. In your previous post you have called me a criminal, a Nazi and a sick person. That is not nice, Srki da...beep. That requires some motherly love to be corrected (I don't believe in punishment as corrective method, you see).

Srki:
Are you dumb or you are pretending you are, to support your argument? I bet it is the second one,

Oh, I can feel a compliment in there...

)

Srki:
Am I wrong if I believe that you posses high-school knowledge in statistics and that you understand why the stochastic approach is used instead of deterministic?

Yes, you are wrong.

Srki:
So, you understand that if some smoker do not get cancer while another 10 do, it doesn't mean that the assumption is wrong and should be abandoned, in particular not in favor of counter assumption. It doesn't mean it is right either, but it tells you undoubtedly what your odds are if you decide to gamble with your life, and lives of your close ones, to satisfy your sick desire.

What I want to say is that I don't believe the figures that are being thrown around as the result of various researches, when it comes to anything, so smoking included, and especially when it comes to passive smoking. Let me give you an example of how careless medical profession can be with figures:

Some 20 or so years ago, UK decided to launch a campaign about drinking. The research they did show that it is ok for males to drink up to 21 units of alcohol a week, and for females, the figure was 14. The unit of alcohol was defined as: one glass of wine; one small beer; one shot of whisky or the like.

Soon after that, Danish government decides to copy the model. And they spend more then a decade and billions of DKK to advertize these limits... until they've found out that 1 unit of alcohol in UK is less in mililiters then in the rest of Europe... Like, one glass of wine in UK is 175 ml, while standard elsewhere (Denmark included) is 200. So, what they've been doing for more then a decade was PROMOTING ALCOHOLISM! With the tax payer's money.

If they can't convert properly, should I trust them to be able to count properly, too? And how many more of such research is being twisted without anyone knowing about it?

All I am saying is: don't buy directly what is being presented. Research researches and studies yourself, before forming an opinion.

Srki:
Not all the humans are the same - some smokers will die in car accident, some non smokers will get lung cancer from radon in their basement. And they all contribute to the statistics. But way more of smokers is going to die as a consequence of smoking.

Now, a question: what if a smoker dies of lung cancer, but induced from radon in their basement, not the smoking? How do they count it? As smoking or radon induced cancer? How do they discern which one was the culprit for lung cancer? I bet they go for their favorite choice: smoking. That's one of the reasons I don't trust those research figures.

Srki:
To summarize, smoking DOES increase risk of the lung cancer death, among other things.

Agree. It's the ratio between "smoking" and "other things" that I think is not being presented in the objective fashion.

Srki:
Why? Because of the cigarette smoke ingredients, of which many are scientifically proven to be carcinogenic. And it will happen to both "active" smokers and "passive", because both inhale the same smoke.

Disagree. I believe passive smoking risks have been blown way out of proportion, quite possibly totally made up. If the passive smoker dies of lung cancer induced by that basement thing, I'm sure they count it as a passive smoking death.

Statistics is like a religion. You either believe in it, or don't, or you are not sure, because you haven't been there to see it with your two own eyes.

Srki:
I think it is pointless to deny obvious facts to support your opinion, it just makes you look silly. Or you still believe that the Earth is flat plate, riding on turtle's back...

Ok, there goes another one. I'm not just a criminal, a Naci, a sick person.... I'm a silly criminal, silly Naci, and a silly sick person.

Srki:
I guess you don't realize how poor is your argument that we all have to die of something, therefore we should let the smokers smoke. Who are you to decide in my name when and what I am going to get sick and die of?

That is EXACTLY my question! Who are you to decide for me that I should not die of smoking?

Srki:
What about us who prefer of dying of aging, or falling of the mountain, or something else, instead of lung cancer or of hearth attack?

Be my guest, take your pick. Die whichever way you want.

Srki:
But let me ask you different question: if someone gets sick of let's say antibiotic-resistant tuberculosis. Would you let him walk on the streets, or you would rather see him quarantined?! Why, well, not everybody who gets in touch with him will necessarily develop symptoms of the decease, some of them will but maybe 15-20 years down the road. Why would you isolate him? He also has family, friends and he is a free citizen, so why would be he kept inside? Can you give me your honest answer, if you can, please?

No sweat, Srki da...beep.
You are comparing uncomparable things here: a contagious disease with the harmless smoking. I can agree that there is some viability in the scientific claims that smoking can increase the risk for catching up some diseases. But I do not buy the passive smoking health risks at all. And it is not like I'm talking about this without anything to back it up. There ARE studies that conclude passive smoking is harmless.

Srki:
Claptrap. Let's leave aside your psychological interpretation of my experiences, that is on the level of "Draga Ljiljo..." columns in daily journals

No, it's not. It's on the level of "Draga Saveta...".

Srki:
Yeah, this shows strength of your arguments, so I'll stop here. I wish you all luck with smoking and I hope you'll be the lucky one that doesn't get cancer or stroke, that screws up the statistics, and that your loved ones also belong to the same statistical category. I'll stay away from people like you, as far as I can

Thanks for good wishes. Likewise to you.
As for staying away... don't worry. Cigarette smoke does not travel through internet. So, sending you one big cyber motherly kiss. Smoke-free!!

Now, off from Oslo to Copenhagen. Long drive. So, back to discussion later this evening, or tomorrow morning.

Krugolina - The Silly Sick Nazi Criminal
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 10:36:08 GMT Krugolina Borup http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smokers of the world - unite! http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85965 It's all just nonsense.
It is more than just nonsense. It is an addiction, and addicts, as a rule, suffer from denial.

Looking at the big picture, however, let it be noted that the majority of Serbs have, sadly, perfected the art of denial on all levels of existence. Therefore, smoking becomes a minor issue. A side effect, if you will. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 07:00:00 GMT ugly http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Why? Really... http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85962
Yes, Serbs smoke way more than Americans, but where is the evidence that "Americans dread visiting Serbia"?

I tend to believe that Americans have little interest in visiting Serbia for a number of reasons which might be worthwhile exploring here (if anyone cares). I suspect that smoking would be at the very bottom of their list of reasons.

As you pointed out, Greece tops the list of the smoking European countries. Nevertheless, it remains one of the most popular destinations for American tourists. We have yet to see their tourist board sweat over smoking. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 06:53:13 GMT ugly http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85960
btw, coca-cola drinks were just an example, maybe not a good one, sorry about that. i also gave an example with alcohol and binge drinking but i can't be bothered arguing any more on this issue.

to wrap it up: STOP DISCRIMINATION AGAINST SMOKERS!!!

vidimo se ljudi ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 06:46:29 GMT irvas http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85956

DejanOz

there is no such thing as "oversmoking".

believe me there is such thing as oversmoking. it can't be the same when i smoke a few cigarettes per day or a few packets per day.

it doesn't matter any more. smoking is a thing of a past wether we like it or not. new generations of humans will not smoke and thats the whole point. they will find something to poson them selves and who knows what's that gonna be...

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 06:35:01 GMT irvas http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85954

its not about how bad smoking is. of course is bad. no one could possibly deny this.

I guess, Krugolina was trying to do that few comments above. Isn't that silly?! ;-)

I could agree with you about the CocaCola, and fast food and some other crap, but that is not as supported with studies of imminent risks, as smoking is. Even in fast food, there is no ingredients that are proven to be carcionegenic as in cigarettes smoke. CocaCola is there for over 40 years and still no one come up with a study showing that it is bad for your health. That is even the case with diet coke as far as I know. Yeah, you'll get fat if you drink it a lot, and you'll become caffeine addict, or you can damage your cells with too much aspartame, but you need to take a lot of it. But you won't die of cancer directly caused by it.

I also kind of disagree with DejanOz. I think fast food is more packed with fats and sugars then any food you can cook or get in average restaurant. He is right saying that if you eat less of it, you'll do better. So at least there is a choice. But if smokers are given ANY rights, like in Serbia for example, rest of us wouldn't have any choice...

I have a question for smokers. I understand they are addicts, same as junkies and their craving for nicotine is of organic nature. But why don't smokers as addicts decide to use nicotine pills, or injections, or patches for example, instead of careless poisoning everybody around? I never smoked, so I speculate on this : is It because they think it is sort of cool to suck the candle and produce the damn smoke? Does that give them some importance in their own eyes? Are they insecure about themselves? I am not sure and I don't claim anything, I'd like to know and understand...

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 06:26:29 GMT Srki http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: Smrt bivsim pusacima http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85953 Finally, anti-smoking campaign had started after the death of the ex-US Vice-president's Al Gore sister, from the lung cancer.
This is not quite simple as that. Minnesota enacted the first smoking ban in US seven years before Gore's sister died. California did it in mid 80's, but majority of other stated waited till the 21st century.

Therefore, I wouldn't necessarily throw Gore (which I personally dislike) into the equation, since there is no clear evidence that the two events are somehow related. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 06:17:06 GMT ugly http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85948 if fastfood and coke (not that one but the drink "coke"

is just as bad for your health, and i strongly believe it is, why don't we have a campaign against that crap too?
As far as I am aware, there is some campaigning going on to limit advertising of fast food to kids. You'd probably be outraged, but I don't think that fast food is a health issue. People who limit their intake of food to recommended amounts and exercise shouldn't have any food-related problems (fast food or slow - I don't think that there is any real difference). If people overeat, than that's a different story. You can make yourself sick by drinking too much water (I've recently heard of at least one case where a person has actually died - not from drowning in it - but from actually drinking too much water).

And there is no such thing as "oversmoking". Smoking is bad. Full stop. Eating is good. Overeating is not. A different game altogether.

I don't want to post off topic, so I think it's better if we stick to smoking and leave the unjustly demonised fast food for some other topic. Before somebody posts a blog like that, you can peruse this little article. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 05:51:02 GMT DejanOz http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85944

DejanOz

I will not be entering into a debate on whether smoking is a health hazard or not, any more than I'd accept a "discussion" on whether the Americans have been to the Moon, or is it all just a hoax and a giant conspiracy.BTW.

still missing the point dejan.

its not about how bad smoking is. of course is bad. no one could possibly deny this. the point is political involvement in anti-smoking propaganda with obvious reason: its bad for your health and we cannot pay medical bills just because people smoke. that's their official reason.

if fastfood and coke (not that one but the drink "coke"

is just as bad for your health, and i strongly believe it is, why don't we have a campaign against that crap too? why don't we have obese people on the bottom of hospital surgery lists? if me, as a non-smoker, used to feel affected in smoking pubs (please don't say that passive smoking is just as bad, its a bullshit ok, i doubt anyone believes in this nonsense) and now I'm happy because no one is allowed to smoke in pubs any more, why should i, as a healthy human being, have to watch all the obese people in malls and streets? same as smokers. we pushed them away from us, why don't we have a right to push away physically-challenged (or fat if you like) people? we don't like smoke and we don't like fat people. how about that?

well dejan, that's where the word "hypocrisy" comes from.
]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 05:27:56 GMT irvas http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85942

irvas

try word "hypocrisy" in wikipedia. it might be helpful to understand contemporary politics.
Hypocrisy notwithstanding (and it will probably remain a mystery to me why would contemporary politics be any different from politics of any time in the past; if not more transparent than ever before - but that's just my feeling) - I will not be entering into a debate on whether smoking is a health hazard or not, any more than I'd accept a "discussion" on whether the Americans have been to the Moon, or is it all just a hoax and a giant conspiracy.

BTW. I happen to disagree with the health insurance providers for not covering the smokers' elective surgery. I also disagree with policies (or policy proposals) that in any way prohibit smoking when done in privacy (eg. smoking when alone in the car). But - having actually seen the dead smokers' lungs - I could never agree that it is not highly damaging to a person's health. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 05:00:33 GMT DejanOz http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85941

DejanOZ

And, why stop there? Maybe they should even encourage smoking, give substinance from the budget for cigarettes to be issued for free at schools and hospitals, and so on.

whatever mate.

try word "hypocrisy" in wikipedia. it might be helpful to understand contemporary politics. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 04:44:53 GMT irvas http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85940 everything they possibly can to combat every potential health hazard that exists, that means that they should leave the smokers alone. And, why stop there? Maybe they should even encourage smoking, give substinance from the budget for cigarettes to be issued for free at schools and hospitals, and so on.

Go ahead, smoke if you will, I don't mind. Not the skin of my nose. ]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 04:28:58 GMT DejanOz http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/ Re: smoking and political correctness http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#k85939
you mentioned something about "significant campaigns against fastfood"etc... not as significant as anti-smoking campaign isn't it?

not to mention constant TV advertisement of mcdonalds, heineken beer, jack daniels bourbon, so living in australia (probably same as you) i have no idea what you're talking about.

alcoholic drinks regulated? well yes, they are regulated in a way that you can't sell/buy alcohol wherever you want.

ok, i have to agree with you in some point. serbia has no regulations about alcohol selling: anyone can buy booze. apart from that, people do drink a lot more here in australia than they do in serbia.

just got back from serbia and friday night in any bar in bg is nothing like friday night in average australian pub. at least i haven't seen people crawling on the streets of belgrade as they do over streets of melbourne on weekend mornings. you can’t deny this.

major health issue: did you know that smokers in australia have no say to elective surgery? no matter for how long and how much they’ve been paying their taxes and private insurances, smokers in australia are the last ones on hospitals surgery lists. Now you tell me dejan, is this discrimination or what? yeah right, is their choice to smoke isn’t it?

please read my previous comment carefully before you continue any further with this.

]]> http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/#komentari Mon, 05 Nov 2007 04:20:16 GMT irvas http://blog.b92.net/text/1270/The%20Smoking%20Thing%3A%20Why%20Americans%20Dread%20Visiting%20Serbia/